I started this topic because some questions I asked and answers I got from cba33558 were getting lost in this rather extensive topic here:


We started this discussion on page 30 of that thread, and I thought I'd move it here so we can continue it (since no one took me up on my offer to start this thread). I'll cut and paste the three posts made after cba33558 posted a chart about eminiviper.com

From 6/8/09:

jimkane: Hey, cba. I checked out that EminiViper.com page. Very impressive. Seems like they don't have any losing days, or even losing trades (or do they not post those?). Is that so? If not, how many stop outs or false signals are you seeing on an average day? It doesn't mean much to me to see winners, I am more interested in the losers I have to take to get those winners. Also, are you the owner of EminiViper.com, or do you work for them? If not, what is your association? If I don't ask, that will likely be the first question from everyone else. Thanks.

cba33558: Hey Jim -

Thanks for visiting the Web site and offering your constructive questions and feedback...

The videos are intended to show the NQ Emini trades that are triggered by the system each day. Currently the system is designed to issue trade signals only the Nasdaq Emini. In addition to the Viper indicator, the system uses a combination of guidance charts and a trading chart that very rarely has a losing trade. With all of these constraints, it should be noted however, that there are not many signals that trigger in any given trading day. Depending on the volatility - usually one or two trades may trigger - a busy day would be 3 trades.

The entire trading system is not shown in the videos; however, all of the details regarding these trade signals are shown in an eBook and training videos. The actual trade signals themselves are analyzed in real-time in the live Webinars. The entire goal of this system was accuracy - not catching every trade.

In answer to your other question, I have been a trader for a little over 12 years now, I am a partner in the firm; and was involved extensively in developing, actively trading and back-testing the Viper system over the past year and a half.

Once again, thank you for your input, and I look forward to opportunity of respectfully participating in your Forum...

jimkane: Thanks for the response, cba. Wow, those are some incredibly impressive stats. Given these are intraday trend trades, it's almost incomprehensible to me. My style is intraday trend trading, and with the 3 to 5 to 1 or sometimes higher reward/risk profiles I'm happy anywhere in the 30% to 50% winners range.

I have a few more questions. Is there a way to follow along and see live trade signals the moment they develop, on a trial basis? The web site mentions visiting a live webinar for a day. Would one see live signals in time to act, or only after they have started? What if no signals are generated that day, can someone try another day? It's very hard to evaluate a system with a one-day trial, especially one that generates only a few signals.

Next, what is the difference between live webinars and live trading room, as far as signals given in real-time? Also, if one signs on to your room and gets all that training, does that do any good without the software? What is the cost of the license, since the website doesn't specify this? I'd love to follow along real-time for a period and evaluate your system, but I'm not sure you have any provisions where I could do that without laying out money first. Again, if I don't ask all these questions, someone else will. Since I'm probably the longest-winded character at this forum, I figured I'd just get the ball rolling. It's not often I hear about a system that has almost no losers at all.

Lastly, if we go much further with this discussion it may be appropriate to move it from this thread to one you or someone else could create in Trading Advisory Services.
Sorry about the format, Guys, I am not very good on the computer. Do not know how to use Word or Xcel. But I am sure uall canfigue out what I have posted
Originally posted by tigerman10

COBRA 09/21 - 09/25 Trading Time 08:35 EST to 11:30 EST
Date trades ticks gross P/L Net(incl. comm)

09/25 0 0 0 0 no trades today... Cobra did not fire
Total Net P/L 960

Hi Tigerman10

did you start Cobra strategy ?

Seems to me Not !

Look at the following post.....it was unfortunately Fired !

Hi All

Here partial results for Cobra today .



Cobra *********
Hi All

Herewith below thew links for the most of the day operations regarding

DiamondBack strategy

Best always

Hi Alinghy,
You are so right! Did not have Cobra turned on. Just fired it up and came up with this fiasco. Down ($1275) for the 8:35 to 11:30 EST time frame. -$1275 - $60.00 (comm)+ 960 = -$375 for the week. Not Good!
Combine this with Diamondback +$697.50. Grantotal of +$322.50. Not Pretty. What is your opinion on this?
Thanks for the correction. No intent to mislead. DUH!
Viper is in Bata testing. Time will tell if it will work as I hope. I have talked with ViperTrader and they are aware of some of short comings and are working to correct these. At the very least these people , I believe, are sincere in their efforts to provide a system for us that are less gifted to trade. Wait and see.
X Tigerman10

One of the most important problems is a big V (as the letter) that yeasterday and also today happened sometimes: there the strategy especially the DiamondBack, probably due to the regression channels
or something in parameters that works like that, allow the entry very late, also after what we could ask breackout, so after, let me say, a long Short, for example, the inversion to a Long period, will give a laye signal, and that costs lots in term of thicks.

Try to use the 'regression channels' utility and make it running long the price line and you'll see how it moves when is into an area as a - V -: channels will open depending on settings and after you drag it at the bottom level of a long Short, as said, then look at the regression channels when during the turning up these are get in the orizontal positon; more or less the distance from the bottom line and the top line of the channel is the new entry level for the long, but this finally depends on the settings the has.

this could be just to give an idea of whay I am saying



here are my testing results for the week:

#1 is Cobra, 2 contracts, profit target is 11 ticks, stop at 13 ticks, breakeven at 11, reverse is true, their recommendataion.

#2 is Cobra, 2 contracts, profit targets are 11 and 15, stop at 13, breakeven at 11, reverse is true.

#3 is Diamondback, 1 contract, profit target is 6, stop is 9, no breakeven or reverse.

#4 is Diamondback, 2 contracts, profit targets are 6 and 8, stop is 9, no breakeven or reverse, their recommendation.

testing from 8:35am through 11:30am. deactivated on thurday from 9:55 to 10:05 and friday 9:50 to 10:06.

here are the totals for the days(ticks):

#1: 26
#2: 15
#3: 9
#4: 3

#1: 18
#2: 11
#3: 6
#4: 6

#1: 44
#2: 22
#3: -6
#4: -8

#1: -52
#2: -52
#3: 39
#4: 63

#1: -30
#2: -27
#3: -18
#4: -16

I recorded the results after 11:30 and didn't refresh the strategy, just looked at the chart and added up the ticks. I've found refreshing the strategy erases some trades and adds others, almost always adds profitable trades and erases stopped out ones. The charts advertised are after a refresh or reload and are always more profitable. They said it might be my datafeed(same as theirs) or my computer(relatively highend)..etc.

They still haven't announced the price. They did say that if a lease was purchased that if you had a month that had a lower profit than the cost of the lease then you would receive a free month, and trading by their guidelines. That could change I suppose. For me, that sounded like it's going to be really expensive, and when I would rely on this system with only one contract, it would probably take me a week or two of the month to pay for it. My tests indicate it was trading profitably 60% of the time.
Originally posted by bubbles


here are my testing results for the week:


I've found refreshing the strategy erases some trades and adds others, almost always adds profitable trades and erases stopped out ones. The charts advertised are after a refresh or reload and are always more profitable.

Does this new Viper auto-refresh feature update your brokerage account balance at the same time ? If so, this is a feature I could warm up to.

... just when i thought this topic couldn't get any more strange...
I second that, I could warm up to that feature, too :-)
Sorry this reply is 2-years late but I just joined the forum.

I know from personal experience that GoToMeeting and GoToWebinar default to showing all users and all comments unless specifically disabled by the Host.

If they're saying what was reported that's a blatant lie.