I started this topic because some questions I asked and answers I got from cba33558 were getting lost in this rather extensive topic here:


We started this discussion on page 30 of that thread, and I thought I'd move it here so we can continue it (since no one took me up on my offer to start this thread). I'll cut and paste the three posts made after cba33558 posted a chart about eminiviper.com

From 6/8/09:

jimkane: Hey, cba. I checked out that EminiViper.com page. Very impressive. Seems like they don't have any losing days, or even losing trades (or do they not post those?). Is that so? If not, how many stop outs or false signals are you seeing on an average day? It doesn't mean much to me to see winners, I am more interested in the losers I have to take to get those winners. Also, are you the owner of EminiViper.com, or do you work for them? If not, what is your association? If I don't ask, that will likely be the first question from everyone else. Thanks.

cba33558: Hey Jim -

Thanks for visiting the Web site and offering your constructive questions and feedback...

The videos are intended to show the NQ Emini trades that are triggered by the system each day. Currently the system is designed to issue trade signals only the Nasdaq Emini. In addition to the Viper indicator, the system uses a combination of guidance charts and a trading chart that very rarely has a losing trade. With all of these constraints, it should be noted however, that there are not many signals that trigger in any given trading day. Depending on the volatility - usually one or two trades may trigger - a busy day would be 3 trades.

The entire trading system is not shown in the videos; however, all of the details regarding these trade signals are shown in an eBook and training videos. The actual trade signals themselves are analyzed in real-time in the live Webinars. The entire goal of this system was accuracy - not catching every trade.

In answer to your other question, I have been a trader for a little over 12 years now, I am a partner in the firm; and was involved extensively in developing, actively trading and back-testing the Viper system over the past year and a half.

Once again, thank you for your input, and I look forward to opportunity of respectfully participating in your Forum...

jimkane: Thanks for the response, cba. Wow, those are some incredibly impressive stats. Given these are intraday trend trades, it's almost incomprehensible to me. My style is intraday trend trading, and with the 3 to 5 to 1 or sometimes higher reward/risk profiles I'm happy anywhere in the 30% to 50% winners range.

I have a few more questions. Is there a way to follow along and see live trade signals the moment they develop, on a trial basis? The web site mentions visiting a live webinar for a day. Would one see live signals in time to act, or only after they have started? What if no signals are generated that day, can someone try another day? It's very hard to evaluate a system with a one-day trial, especially one that generates only a few signals.

Next, what is the difference between live webinars and live trading room, as far as signals given in real-time? Also, if one signs on to your room and gets all that training, does that do any good without the software? What is the cost of the license, since the website doesn't specify this? I'd love to follow along real-time for a period and evaluate your system, but I'm not sure you have any provisions where I could do that without laying out money first. Again, if I don't ask all these questions, someone else will. Since I'm probably the longest-winded character at this forum, I figured I'd just get the ball rolling. It's not often I hear about a system that has almost no losers at all.

Lastly, if we go much further with this discussion it may be appropriate to move it from this thread to one you or someone else could create in Trading Advisory Services.
Originally posted by FuturesTraderDad

I would assume you guys are just idiots on this forum, because if you think about it, the Viper people would disguise the email addresses from their chat log to keep competitors from getting their email addresses. I am still very happy with Viper and very disappointed in this loser site that would not know a good thing if it bit them. Maybe the reason you left Viper, is because you do not have the mental capacity to understand them, although my twelve year old grandaughter does. I personally watched one of the Viper guys show us his live account with over a $3000 trade with TF on Friday.

My Pivots is a total loser site. I have seen very few constructive posts, they are always negative, defamatory, libelous, and slanderous!! If I were these guys, I would contact a lawyer, and sue the socks off this site.

I am sensing a huge amount of anger from you and thus cannot understand why you keep replying to us the way you do. Using words like idiots, losers, etc show a lack of respect for people who do not share your same view point. You sound like that guy in Oakland who wonderfully recaps the day when he has all the info in front of him.

Once I see account statements from when Viper went live on the web, last August I believe, I will cease my comments and rejoin.

BTW, the following quote "This will be my last post, because your negative energy could rub off on me." is from your 7/2/10 post. Must be Viper's negative energy rubbing off on you.

Maybe the loser part and idiot part was a little harsh, but think about it. If you had a business and had hundreds or perhaps thousands of subscriber's email addresses, would it not be a breach of their right to privacy to post their name and email without their written permission. The way I would do it, would be to copy the live quotes, and hide the emails and names to protect the subscribers, but for you to insinuate they are not accurate quotes is ridiculous. I have seen their system, and I know by their teaching webinars, they are very good teachers. You might want to sign up again, because I see genuine people interested in helping traders become even better. How many other trading sytems offer a Chat room, and as many webinars as these guys teach. My hat is off to them for their dedication and commitment. You could make enough in one day to pay their subscription for a year if you follow what they teach.

As far as the last comment you made about me not posting again, I could not resist when I saw that ridiculous post of yours about the email addresses not being genuine, and I posted the reason I would not put the customer's email for anyone to use without permission from the customer
I am, for reason unknown, still on their distribution list. Their most recent email announced another $3,000 + day trading several markets and over $45,000 profit for the month. One would think with returns that large someone in the media would pick this up or users of their auto systems would be boasting all over the net!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Not a peep!!

A wise man learns by the mistakes of others, a fool by his own.
Latin Proverb
I bet they are glad you are not with them, you guys would not know a good thing if it bit you. I watch those guys everyday, and I am not disappointed. They are frankly amazing with their calls. I just go with the flow and watch my account grow. Too bad you guys are so negative, you do not know a good thing. Those guys do more teaching and mentoring in their webinars than any other trading service I know of. I am glad you are not part of their group, because your negative energy would rub off on us. I believe if you were part of the team, you would bring so many negative vibes into the room and that would not be good. Losers tend to stay with losers, so I guess this forum is where you belong.

On the question from Jack. How do you know they are not growing exponentially. Maybe they will be on Ophra next, or CNBC with Maria Bartiromo.
Show me the money!

You are missing the money, because you are not with them. I was in the room again today, and I saw over $2000 called in great trades... I could not believe it, exact tops and bottoms. They are very hard to beat, but you guys can stay on this loser forum, but I am taking my money to the bank with these guys. I have brought two more people on with them, and they have watched the webinars, and are already doing great. Loser Forum, no Money!!! Viper member, great money!!! You choose.

By the way, they do show their accounts in the room, as they make great trades!!!!
Show me the money!
I am sure you are never going to figure it out!! They do show the money in the room everyday. I was in there today, and one of the moderators showed us live, step by step, swing by swing and he was right on the money with his calls. I was able to jump in and make very good money as he was teaching. Tell me if there is anyone else on the web that trades live, teaches, mentors, and cares about their subscribers like these guys do, and I would switch. I would say there is no-one willing to do that, so I am with Viper. You will never see the money because you are too busy posting on forums to make money. I will say it again and again, most of the posts on this forum are from disgruntled traders, that cannot trade, so they spend their time bashing those that can trade, and those that can teach. Loser forum (My Pivots), winner (Viper)
Show me the money!
Sorry this reply is 2-years late but I just joined the forum.

I know from personal experience that GoToMeeting and GoToWebinar default to showing all users and all comments unless specifically disabled by the Host.

If they're saying what was reported that's a blatant lie.