I started this topic because some questions I asked and answers I got from cba33558 were getting lost in this rather extensive topic here:


We started this discussion on page 30 of that thread, and I thought I'd move it here so we can continue it (since no one took me up on my offer to start this thread). I'll cut and paste the three posts made after cba33558 posted a chart about eminiviper.com

From 6/8/09:

jimkane: Hey, cba. I checked out that EminiViper.com page. Very impressive. Seems like they don't have any losing days, or even losing trades (or do they not post those?). Is that so? If not, how many stop outs or false signals are you seeing on an average day? It doesn't mean much to me to see winners, I am more interested in the losers I have to take to get those winners. Also, are you the owner of EminiViper.com, or do you work for them? If not, what is your association? If I don't ask, that will likely be the first question from everyone else. Thanks.

cba33558: Hey Jim -

Thanks for visiting the Web site and offering your constructive questions and feedback...

The videos are intended to show the NQ Emini trades that are triggered by the system each day. Currently the system is designed to issue trade signals only the Nasdaq Emini. In addition to the Viper indicator, the system uses a combination of guidance charts and a trading chart that very rarely has a losing trade. With all of these constraints, it should be noted however, that there are not many signals that trigger in any given trading day. Depending on the volatility - usually one or two trades may trigger - a busy day would be 3 trades.

The entire trading system is not shown in the videos; however, all of the details regarding these trade signals are shown in an eBook and training videos. The actual trade signals themselves are analyzed in real-time in the live Webinars. The entire goal of this system was accuracy - not catching every trade.

In answer to your other question, I have been a trader for a little over 12 years now, I am a partner in the firm; and was involved extensively in developing, actively trading and back-testing the Viper system over the past year and a half.

Once again, thank you for your input, and I look forward to opportunity of respectfully participating in your Forum...

jimkane: Thanks for the response, cba. Wow, those are some incredibly impressive stats. Given these are intraday trend trades, it's almost incomprehensible to me. My style is intraday trend trading, and with the 3 to 5 to 1 or sometimes higher reward/risk profiles I'm happy anywhere in the 30% to 50% winners range.

I have a few more questions. Is there a way to follow along and see live trade signals the moment they develop, on a trial basis? The web site mentions visiting a live webinar for a day. Would one see live signals in time to act, or only after they have started? What if no signals are generated that day, can someone try another day? It's very hard to evaluate a system with a one-day trial, especially one that generates only a few signals.

Next, what is the difference between live webinars and live trading room, as far as signals given in real-time? Also, if one signs on to your room and gets all that training, does that do any good without the software? What is the cost of the license, since the website doesn't specify this? I'd love to follow along real-time for a period and evaluate your system, but I'm not sure you have any provisions where I could do that without laying out money first. Again, if I don't ask all these questions, someone else will. Since I'm probably the longest-winded character at this forum, I figured I'd just get the ball rolling. It's not often I hear about a system that has almost no losers at all.

Lastly, if we go much further with this discussion it may be appropriate to move it from this thread to one you or someone else could create in Trading Advisory Services.
Says you.

It is the only trading room I have been in where the comments of the other participants are hidden from others.

Read this thread. Then take the Viper trial. You can learn everything they know in 30 days. Actually in only about 1 day. But take the whole trial. Then come back here and tell us what you have learned. Then cancel and move on to one of the many other trading rooms that don't need to hide the comments of its participants.

And watch for these:

- They don't use their own indicators most of the time. They just draw boxes around the trading range and wait for a breakout. Except when they are hawking their products.

- Repeated making promises about this and that, that never come to past.

- Repeatedly addressing newb issues because they are constantly churning existing members and bringing in new; customer base is comprised of people who know nothing about trading - no long term members.

- Calling the trades after the fact.

- Lying about their bad trades.

Watch these guys closely. It wont take long to learn all that they know. Then move on. There are some trading rooms with integrity that don't need to hide anything. All of them are trying to sell you something. But at least some of them are honest.

Try Viper for 30 days, or less. Or until you can't stand the BS any longer and then move on. Then come tell us what you have learned.

All I learned from them is that there are some men who have no shame.

Thank you for your wise and insightful commentary. Maybe this will end the naysayers and warn others of these fakes.

I was in their webinar last night, they keep sending me links to their chat room and the webinars, I was hoping that I could pick up something, anything, that I could use. Again, I was out of luck. Apparently the news of the day produced a market that was trending for the next hour or so. In the webinar Charles starts off with the question, "what is the market doing after the news?" He is so good at looking at a chart and showing what has happened. Then he started explaining how to trade a market that trended upward after the news, bracketing the news. And if you did this you would have made an easy $750, it was a no brainer for anyone. Then when the trend started to end it would be time to get out. When I subscribed they always told us to stay away from the news.

If the viper team could just post their trading accounts using the manual system and the autotrader that supposedly makes tens of thousands per month they would appear more legitimate.

In the chat room, Gary shows his trades from time to time, I'm thinking that he takes a long and short trade at the exact same time and then shows the profitable one to the audience. Obviously, the proftable trade would either be a probe or a breakout.
Sorry this reply is 2-years late but I just joined the forum.

I know from personal experience that GoToMeeting and GoToWebinar default to showing all users and all comments unless specifically disabled by the Host.

If they're saying what was reported that's a blatant lie.